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Action Replay Central :: View topic - Thinking of going PS3? think again,,,

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Thinking of going PS3? think again,,,


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PostPosted: Sun Nov 27, 2005 3:23 pm   Post subject: Thinking of going PS3? think again,,,
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I don't think the PS3 sucks, but since IGN was stupid enough to publish some trash with crappy reasons not to get an Xbox 360... all bets are off. http://ps3.ign.com/articles/668/668446p1.html.

1. No Live! In fact, sony came out and recently announced that they're not even going to bother to build an answer to Xbox Live.

Sony, you can keep your ability to plug in 7 controllers. I'll take being able to play with 63 other players on live in a fps over 7 controllers any day of the week.

2. The 36.5 megabits per second blu ray drive that Sony is squeezing into the PS3.

The BD-Rom drive that's going to be used in the PS3 has a speed of 36.5 MBits per second. 36.5megaBITS per second, not megaBYTES. 8bits=1byte=4.5megaBYTES per second. http://www.blu-ray.com/faq/

This is because the technology for the drives will still be in it's infancy when the ps3 is being launched.

That means in order to fill the 256MB cache (to load a decent sized race on GT4 let's say) will take about 56 seconds of waiting.

To fill the same 256MB cache on the xbox 360's 12x DVD drive read at 15.75MB/s (megabytes) = 15 seconds

I know you know your math.

If you want an idea of how long a minute is, try staring at a clock for a minute and see how bored you get.

I'm not going to stand for huge loading times next gen as well. Long load times are meant to be a thing of the past. But Sony is making sure that's not the case by insisting on using Blu Ray drives when the technology (and their read speeds) are still so early.

On top of this, Playstation 3 Blu Ray drive will cost Gamers $100+ per console. http://www.theinquirer.net/?article=25901

And within 1 year, once blu-ray movies actually start coming out, the same $100 would probably buy you a far faster 4x or 8x blu-ray player that functions a lot better (compare watching dvds on a standalone player vs. on the original ps2). And do you really think that, if blu-ray does come out on top, that the 360 won't release with a version that can play bluray versions as well? Legally, as long as MS pays the same small fees that other blu ray player manufacterers pay to use sony's tech, Sony can't stop MS from putting blu ray drives in their 360s. And by then, the drives will likely be a lot cheaper, and a lot faster than the once found on the launch PS3s.

3. Opting for 8 USB ports and multiple memory card readers over a HDD.

There's no reason to put in like 8 usb ports and all these freaking memory card reader and all these other ports that no one wants. We can buy a memory card adapter if we want.

We don't need 3 ethernet ports, one will be more than plenty. JUST INCLUDE 4 USB 2.O PORTS, 1 ETHERNET PORT, SUPPORT FOR SONY MEMORY STICK DUOS (since that's what psp uses and that's what makes Sony the most money) AND THE STUFF TO CONNECT TO ANALOG AND HDTVS.

USE THE MANUFACTURING COSTS YOU SAVE TO THROW IN A CHEAP 5GB HDD so developers can make games like Blinx or FFXI or use the HDD to reduce load times and stuff.

IF A SMALL HDD IS INCLUDED IN EVERY SYSTEM, EVERY DEVELOPER WILL USE IT TO REDUCE LOAD TIMES. Don't you guys want developers to use the hdd to reduce loadtimes, to make games like FFXI that require a HDD? wouldn't that be better than a bunch of useless ports that no one will use that you can just buy an adapter for if you really need?

SELL THE ADAPTER TO CONNECT OLD PS2 AND PS1 GAMES SEPERATELY FOR LIKE $10 AND YOU'LL MAKE ENOUGH TO COMPENSATE FOR THE HDD. Once we transfer all our old saves over to the HDD, we can just sell it on ebay or something and it's one less ugly port we have to look at.

HDD = Custom soundtracks, downloadable content, FFXI style mmorpgs, faster load times.

Multiple seperate Memory Card Readers Built in = Worthless

4. Sony disabling the ability to have LAN parties (without getting wired controllers) by insisting on using bluetooth controllers over Infrared ones.

"Bain admitted that the wireless signal could be interfered with by another nearby PlayStation 3 console and in those instances where many consoles would be close by, such as at a LAN party, it would be necessary to default to using wired controllers"

5. The Cell.

Not only is the cell processor going to jack up the price of the PS3 quite a bit. It's greatly bottlenecked by the 512 MBs of L2 Cache (the 360 has twice that much L2 Cache).

For all the hype about the cell. Guess what, the processor means jack when it comes to gaming. 3 3.2 ghz cores vs. 1 3.2 ghz core and 7 PPEs mean nothing. What matters for gaming is the GPU. And most reports (anandtech etc.) state that the 360's graphics card is almost a generation more advanced. This makes sense, ATI built the card from the ground up with technology that won't make it's way into PC cards for atleast an year or so. The NVIDEA card in the PS3 is identical to the card as what'll be available for the PC in a month or two. The only thing that the cpu will actually matter for is the AI. And AI is more depenedent on L2 cache (this is what ultimately determines the number of simultanous algorithms you can run at any one time) than on processing speed. And guess what, the 360's has twice the L2 cache of the PS3's Cell!

6. No requirement to make developers use 720p.

People make the ps3s 1080i sound like it's going to be standard. All that sony said was the the PS3 supports aka. can theoretically output 1080i.

Guess what, the original xbox "supports" 720p (identical to how the ps3 will "support" 1080i).

Want to guess how many xbox games actually came out offering 720p? I'll give you one guess.

Want to take a guess how many ps3 games wil actually offer 1080i (Or the even more useless dual monitor output) esp. considering how much extra work it'll be to render everything at that resolution for two monitors - as if the PS3's measily 512 L2 Cache isn't already enough of a bottleneck?

The cool thing about the 360 is that all the games are required to support 720p, and considering that's a MUCH MUCH MUCH higher resolution than dvds, it's more than enough.

7. Accessible cost

Blu-ray wont be cheap! Cell won't be cheap! Odds are, when the PS3 finally does come out, MS will lower the price a bit and the PS3 will cost a small fortune by comparison. The discs cost a small fortune to manufacture, don't expect games under $70 atleast for an year or so, and if then you consider the development costs who knows!

8.The Games.

Well this one is kind of a toss up. The Xbox 360's Kameo, Enchant Arm, Perfect Dark (drool), RE5, Gears of War, Blue Dragon, Oblivion, FPS, Racers (Forza, PGR), DoA etc. vs. GTA 4 and whatever sequels Sony has planned. What is true is the the 360s gaming library will get a one year headstart, and the PS3's will probably take a long time to catch up, if ever.

9. The Design.

Well this is personal opinion too. But who came with the brilliant idea to model it after a building anyways? Fire them and make it look next gen. My old Atari Jaguar looks less crappy. YOU CALL THAT A NEXT GEN DESIGN!? There is really no symmetry to it at all. Put the drive in the middle, get rid of the weird ridges and make it actually look smooth in the front and back and well. Then you have a nextgen looking consoles.

IT REALLY WOULDN'T TAKE MANY ALTERATIONS TO MAKE THE CONSOLE LOOK AWESOME, GET RID OF THE RIDGES SO ITS LOOKS PERFECTLY SMOOTH ON THE FRONT AND THE BACK, MOVE THE CD TRAY TO THE MIDDLE TO MAKE THE CONSOLE SYMMETRICAL. IT WOULD LOOK AWESOME.

10. Developer Hell.

No one has any experience working with the Cell. 7 PPEs, seriously, you think any developer is going to have any idea how to utilize them? Just making a game that uses dual processors takes a 50% larger budget. Meanwhile, developers are already raving about how much easier Microsoft's standards and XNA development kits are making it to develop 360 games. And it's a heck of a lot cheaper to manufacture the discs too. Even small developers with just $100,000 can make their own game and sell it via Xbox Live marketplace.

And as already mentioned the L2 cache of the PS3's cell in miniscule. Most PC processors and the 360's processor have twice the cache. To make a processor with half the cache and expect it to be shared among 7 PPEs is just asking for developers to curse Sony day and night.

On top of all this, by the time the PS3 launches, developers will have had loads of experience of utilizing the 360. Expect the 2nd generation 360 games using much smaller budgets to blow the first generation PS3 games out of the water graphically.

If you managed to get so drunk you actually get it, you can always use it as a radiator.
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 27, 2005 5:20 pm   Post subject:
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Those were very good points The Jambo. Now I have more reasons to hate PS3. lol :lol:
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 28, 2005 11:51 am   Post subject:
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At first I didn't even read your full post The Jambo. I stopped at:

" xbox 360's 12x DVD drive read at 15.75MB/s (megabytes) "

Everyone (or at least I thought) knows that everything technology-wise is measures in bits, almost never in bytes, unless they speak about storage space (1.5 MB floppy, 20 GB HDD), then usually they speak in bits.

X-box 360's drive is running at 15.75 megabits per second, and so therefore about 2 megabytes per second. So it would take 128 seconds, or over 2 minutes to fills 360's cache.

But who cares anyway? No game ever uses the entire cache, and if it does, usually does it while the game is already running, via clever programming, so that the user doesn't even notice.
On Gamecube, Metroid Prime probably loads the 1st three set save rooms as you navigate the title screen and menu, and then loads the next room as you explore the previous. Clever programming can completely eliminate potentially merciless loadtimes. At least Nintendo has figured that out.

So anyway, PS3 can load over 2 times faster than X-box 360.
Why? Because when these dudes designed these drives for movie-watching, they knew that a BD drive needs to load High Definition movie content at a higher speed than DVD movie content, there's so much more data!


======


Upon reading more of your post, I came across the BD-drive costing gamers $100 per console.

I hope this is true, because when BD-movies come out, the first few 2x and 4x drives are going to cost hundreds of dollars. Thanks to Sony, I'll be saving loads.
Plus Keep in mind that the high-speed DVD drive on the X-box 360 is probably costing gamers at least $30... So there's only a $70 for a high-speed inexpensive HD-disc drive...


======


I understand that the PS3 will be hell for developers, and will be mighty expensive, and I'll have to buy the games on 400 GB BD-discs, and I'm sure 400 gigabytes on a single disc mighyt ask for a pretty penny more than standard DVD, but I'm willing to pay a lot to play MGS4, the FF series, Resident Evil 5, and others in glorious 1080i.

About the LAN Party, only wired, in the quote, he said:
"the wireless signal could be interfered with by another nearby PlayStation 3 console"
I'm sure if you have seven controllers talking to one console, and seven others talking the the other console within 10 feet of each other, you are going to have a problem, but why would anypone need to have a LAN party when they can simply hook up two televisions to the same PS3 (not necessarily 1080i, perhaps standard analog even), with 4 players on one screen and 3 on the other... Already you have a setup that is just one player short of Mario Kart:DD's LAN capability, and through only one console, no extra connections needed.

Also, about "No Live," who's to say that Sony won't have any online at all? Nintendo has online with Nintendo DS now, and will for Revolution. You don't need a service to allow online multiplayer.
This also opens up the possibility of free online multiplayer in some games. As for 64 Player Deatmatch, why wouldn't Sony be able to do something like that without a Service like Live? ure that gamemight cost extra to play it's multiplayer if everything isn't hosted through a single service, but we don't know what they're going to do yet, PS3 is still a potential year away.

======

ALso, I was just thinking, Nintendo has not released any specs on the NRV console itself. Perhaps in a full year, they may be able to make console's somewhat close to X-box 360's capability, and still keep the $200 price tag. Just a thought.

I'll be getting NRV in this upcoming console race. When it comes out, I'll be playing away a popular Nintendo franchises with crazy, unique gameplay. Once PS3 has been out for a while, I'll look at it, and I'll look at 360. I'll look at the games, the reviews, and even what people thought about PS3's "Dual 1080i Output" vs. 360's HD-output... I look closely at which games are out for 360, and their graphics, and gameplay, and compare them to PlayStation 3's. When I decide then, when the heat has gone down, I'll purchase my best pick.

But Nintendo's console i so incredibly different, and so inxpensive, that I can buy it, no worries, without having to compare anything to the other two big guys. There is no "X-box is better than Gamecube" or "GCN has better graphics than PS2"... There's just Revolution, and there's the 'other' videgame consoles.
I think this was Nintendo's plan.
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 28, 2005 12:46 pm   Post subject:
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Quote:
9. The Design.

Well this is personal opinion too. But who came with the brilliant idea to model it after a building anyways? Fire them and make it look next gen. My old Atari Jaguar looks less crappy. YOU CALL THAT A NEXT GEN DESIGN!? There is really no symmetry to it at all. Put the drive in the middle, get rid of the weird ridges and make it actually look smooth in the front and back and well. Then you have a nextgen looking consoles.

IT REALLY WOULDN'T TAKE MANY ALTERATIONS TO MAKE THE CONSOLE LOOK AWESOME, GET RID OF THE RIDGES SO ITS LOOKS PERFECTLY SMOOTH ON THE FRONT AND THE BACK, MOVE THE CD TRAY TO THE MIDDLE TO MAKE THE CONSOLE SYMMETRICAL. IT WOULD LOOK AWESOME.


WHAT?! The new controller is awesome! It's simply genious!
look:

1: you play a game
2: you hate the game
3: You need to throw something at the game
AND THAT is where the controller comes in, the ideal thing INNOVATION MY FRIEND... A boomerang! when your toast machine console toasts the game that you dislike, you simply throw the controller at it... AND IT COMES BACK! This is incredibly incredibly incredibly usefull, people have worked years to archieve this!

anyway on to the serious part...
Yes, the design sucks since there is no use for a toaster that can be controlled with an next-gen boomerang
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 28, 2005 5:06 pm   Post subject:
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I have never felt the controller, so could not make a judgement.
I have never seen a PS3 in person, so I could not make a judgement on its size, but I actually think that the design is not half bad... Although it doesn't look like you can set it on its side at all... At least X360 and NRV can both be either way.
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 02, 2006 9:46 pm   Post subject:
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At the end of the day: Do console specs really concern us gamers? The only thing I am concerned about is the price and overall durability.
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 02, 2006 9:57 pm   Post subject:
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PyroHazard wrote:
The only thing I am concerned about is the price and overall durability.

And the games that are on it.
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 03, 2006 7:44 am   Post subject:
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durability?? i want good functionality, high performance and quality games with brilliant online integration.
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 03, 2006 7:06 pm   Post subject:
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So you don't mind if your 360 breaks or overheats right after your warranty expires, as long as you had fun with the great, high performance games while it lasted?
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 04, 2006 2:27 am   Post subject:
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no i wouldnt, AND im buying a 3 year warrenty for it, £30!
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 05, 2006 9:41 pm   Post subject:
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Speaking of consoles not breaking, I was playing my Intellivision yesterday...
Manufactured in 1979... That makes it 27 years old!!!
It 10 years older than I am!!!

OH! And another by the way:
My Birthday was January 2nd! (3 days ago) YAYz!
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 06, 2006 2:05 am   Post subject:
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Happy late birthday! :D (you should have made a topic about it 3 days ago)
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 15, 2006 12:50 pm   Post subject:
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I'd rather Sony concentrate on getting the launch right, please refer to the Xbox 360 with how not to do it, kthnx.
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 30, 2006 7:38 am   Post subject:
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i think it would be nice, if sony just shriveled up and died.
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